Way to Russia Talk Lounge

jurrie · Just Starting Joined: 19 Jan 2005 Posts: 2

I want to travel to moscow in May this year by car and would like to sell it there. Does anybody know how hard it will be to do this? Especially if you don't speak Russian. Maybe people are interested in selling it for me and get a nice commission.

Jurrie

Intourist · Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 12:16 pm Post subject:

Jurrie,

It's a nightmare from anyway you look at it, if you speak Russian. Forget English.

First of all, you'll have a large headache importing the car. Aside from the myriad of paperwork you'll need to fill out at the border to permanently import the car, you'll pay import fees of anywhere between 50% to 100% of the car's value. That's right. Those fees are there for a pretty good reason, too. To protect the $3000 cars sold by Russian manufacturers that could never compete with used foreign cars.

You'll also need to get the car technically inspected. If there's anything on your car that doesn't conform to Russian standards (and trust me, there will be) you'll either have to take the car to be modified or pay a bribe for the cops to 'overlook' it.

Second, selling it is no piece of cake either. At some point, the car needs to be registered to you via a PTS (somewhat like a 'deed'). If you don't have one issued here, you'll have to get your foreign one notarized, translated and apostilled. If you've imported it permanently at the border, then presumably you'll have to get one. If you don't have one, I'd suspect you can't legally sell the car until you get one. Kicker is, once you go through all this, you have to go to GAI to 'unregister' yourself to be able to transfer the deed to someone else at what's called a 'commisiony' where you pay the applicable sales tax.

Basically, it all begs the question as to why you would even concieve of such an idea ? Are you hoping for a higher price abroad than in your home country ? If so, Russia ain't it. Most likely, you'll probably *lose* a bundle after import fees, bribes, sales tax, etc.

Just my two cents.

Camrade · Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 3:59 pm Post subject:

2Intourist

There are shit lots of car sellers who get european cars from abroad. They just have to wait for some hours on a customs.
But I suppose there's no problem in selling car, I mean not such a big problem as you've described.

overseas_expat · VIP Joined: 11 Jan 2005 Posts: 620 Location: Moscow

Huh???? Are you another one of those "I'm a student in Russia and everything is happy happy, hunkey dorey?" Intourist is right on the money. Not so much as a comma out of place. His advise contains not ONE SHRED of misinformation. The questioner was well served by his response, and admonished to ignore yours, Camrade.

Where are they selling these rose colored glasses everybody on this website seems to be wearing? I need to get a pair.

Jurrie--The correct information was given to you by Intourist. Ignore it at your own peril.

Dr Fauste · Site Admin Joined: 23 Nov 2004 Posts: 654

Expat, I have a song made just for people like you.

Camrade · Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 9:54 pm Post subject:

2overseas_expat

Wink

there are too much weirdoes on this forum...
are you one of them? did I say something terrible?
I just expressed alternative opinion which is based on experiense (not my experience certainly) Smile

so try to be a little more polite arguing

overseas_expat · VIP Joined: 11 Jan 2005 Posts: 620 Location: Moscow

You hit the nail on the head: you expressed an opinion. Intourist answered Jurrie's question with facts. You can't import cars on opinion. The law and militsia are not interested in opinion.

You are wrong and Intourist is right. Period.

Intourist · Posted: Thu Jan 20, 2005 11:18 am Post subject:

Comrade,

I'm not saying that cars aren't bought or sold here, they are, of course. Nevermind the fact that the original thread starter doesn't even speak Russian, it's a pretty big headache for locals, nevertheless.

I've bought and sold two cars here. One from a "salon" (dealership) and one by generalnaya doverennost (power of attorney). It involves numerous trips to several different places, loads of waiting, paperwork and bureaucrats and hassle. Add to that being a foreigner, and you're lucky if you can complete the process in anything under a few weeks.

That's another point I neglected to mention in my first post. Any cars owned by foreigners have to be processed by a GIBDD (traffic police) that's in Tsaritsino. The car is only registered as long as your visa registration is valid for (i.e. the car's regisrtation has to be renewed at least once every six months). How's that for fun ?

There are of course large dealers and small time importers that make a living doing this, but they have people who work for them, connections, etc. They know what they're doing (and it still involves a lot of hassle). An individual intending to do what Jurrie asked can make one mistake and f*ck the whole process up and cost himself months of time.

There was a Kommersant article a couple years ago that listed a statistic, by the way, that 50% of all cars imported into the country (not by offical dealers) were imported illegally or stolen.

It is all my opinion, of course, and one I find difficult to disagree with based on my experience.

jurrie · Just Starting Joined: 19 Jan 2005 Posts: 2

To Intourist: Many thanks for your clear point of view. It gave me a good impression of what kind of trouble I can get myself into. I will reconsider selling my car in moscow for sure.

Grtz

Jurrie

vettra · Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2005 6:56 pm Post subject: Re: Many thanks

Hi,
I have a question about bringing a car to russia - but not to sell.
Just to drive. I plan to relocateto Volgograd, and take with me my
Dodge Durango SUV. It's got a 5" lift (eg., it is about 8cm taller than
normal). Big concern is that it doesn't get stolen. I've lived in
Ukraine 3 years and my Russian is good. I assume I'd keep it in a
stoyanka, watched parking lot. From what I read, most thefts seem to
happen overnight if the car is not garaged (on the streets or outside
buildings). Having an American license plate ...- what's the most likely:
a) gets ripped off a few days after I cross the border;
b) it may last 6 months or so before thugs take it;
c) I may suffer a slashed tire or broken window ocassionally;
d) As long as I drive it ocassionally and keep it garaged it should be OK;
e) ..other?
Given all the mafioso types driving $100K mercedes, there must be ways to
prevent thievery. One obvious step is to get temporary plates. Then thugs
will think I am a big bad guy with my own krisha and kalashnikovs?
I know in Ukraine, it is standard to issue license plates for 1 year.
I don't know if Russia does this. Also, can I get insurance from a
Russian company? Will they handle foreign-owned cars? Would it cost a
fortune?

qwaal · Posted: Wed May 04, 2005 12:25 am Post subject:

Don't know how much help it is, but I've had our British-registered car here in Moscow for several months already, parked on the road outside our block and in various places around the city, with no problems. However, it is not so eye-catching as yours, being a 10-year old hatchback.

Insurance on foreign-registered cars in Russia is no problem, the cost isn't altered by the registration plates.

Getting Russian plates is extremely expensive; importing the car requires an import fee related to the notional value of your car - a significant percentage of the value. Even for temporary import the fee is related to the car's value, but it is a smaller percentage!

RacingTeatray · Just Starting Joined: 22 Jul 2005 Posts: 3

Intourist · Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2005 12:32 pm Post subject:

qwaal · Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2005 11:02 pm Post subject:

RacingTeatray · Just Starting Joined: 22 Jul 2005 Posts: 3